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Author Topic: No wonder there aren't any bars left to play in
rjthe1god
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Karaoke $69 Trial Offer

150,000 songs

I guess you can afford to do crap deals when you pay crap for your material

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Randy Jersky
Owner/Operator
Sound Waves DJ/Karaoke Service

Posts: 1795 | From: Fall River, Ma | Registered: Feb 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Showtimecalls
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kinda funny isnt it? Funny how he doesnt leave his name though
Posts: 1483 | From: Kansas City MO 64119 | Registered: Mar 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Timberlea
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Well the cell phone is out of Fall River, Mass. Go get 'em SC.
Posts: 391 | From: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada | Registered: Mar 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
rjthe1god
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There are so many guys out here it really doesn't surprise me. 90% of it is because the bar owners around here are as cheap as it comes.

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Randy Jersky
Owner/Operator
Sound Waves DJ/Karaoke Service

Posts: 1795 | From: Fall River, Ma | Registered: Feb 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Jason Christopher
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Randy,

I'm going to probably tick you off with this comment but, I don't see ANY issue with offering a new bar a special rate.

Please see their note 'TRIAL OFFER' and TRY OUR SERVICE at this rate ... some conditions apply.

Listen, when I needed gigs when I was staring, I did a FREE trial. When I promote restaurnts for my other service (I also do magic table to table at restaurants) I offer my first night FREE.

Now, I'm NOT speaking directly to you, since this is a public forum and an 'open' converstation ... so don't take it as such and don't take in personally.

I hear so many KJ's complaining How can I compete? There's no shows ... I have to lower my rates. Quite frankly THAT'S BULL!

If you are not getting the gigs you want. It's YOUR FAULT. What are YOU going to do about it?
If you are not getting the price you want, it's YOUR FAULT. What are YOU going to do about it?

So what if this guy goes out and keeps his night for $69 ? what does that do to YOU ? Come on now...really ... does that REALLY effect the rate YOU charge? I does IF you lower your price based on that. I have a ton of people in my area that charge less then me. Some of which have tried to come into my bars and restaurnts and take my job. It has never NEVER happended. Why? Because they hire ME not just a KJ.

Make yourself unique and a benefit to your bar and you can keep AND RAISE your rates becuase they are booking YOU.

Stop passing sucess or failure off on other people ... other KJ's ... other bar owners.

A friend of mine whos a soccer coach always uses this saying (don't know if it's his or not) and he has the team place this on their mirrors:

" You are looking at the person who is most responsible for your attitude, motivation, determination, success and failure. "

So now knowing that I ask ... what are YOU going to do about it?

Jason

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Jason Christopher
Discover How To Increase The Money You Earn As A KJ During Each Show And Have Your Phone Ringing Off The Hook With Prospects Looking To Book YOU! Visit www.makemoneywithkaraoke.com today for FREE mini E-Course

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Timberlea
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Now we have a "Tony" whatever his name is (make millions for nothing) in karaoke. Yeah right. I smell something here.

Remember folks if it sound too good to be true, then it ain't.

Posts: 391 | From: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada | Registered: Mar 2002  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
rjthe1god
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I don't have a problem with giving a new gig a cut rate. But there is giving a place a deal, and then there is working for peanuts. There was a time where I could walk into almost any bar in RI or Southern MA and after talking to the owner, I was in, and I got paid.

Now because everyone around here has apparently gone out and spent the minimum amount of start up cost so they offer themselves at a reduced rate to get the gigs, doesn't matter if they know how to run a show, all that matters to the owners around here is how much this is going to cost them.

Now eventually these guys are so lousy that they finally loose the gig, but the owners are so cheap instead of hiring somebody that can do a good job, they just go for the next cheapest alternative.

So it leaves me at a crossroad, do I cut my throat and price match, or do I say they can have the rat trap and bide my time. The latter is where I am. I truly miss being out at more bar/club shows but I'm certainly not going to give my services away for pennies on the dollar.

Again these guys don't realize what they are doing to the industry. First by not paying for the music, we can't get more of what we want for our customers, and second by undercutting all the reputalble people they have lowered the quality and income of the industry making it nearly impossible to a: make any type of living off of it, and b: no way to cover the costs of using the equipment, hence no way of replacing worn or broken equipment.

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Randy Jersky
Owner/Operator
Sound Waves DJ/Karaoke Service

Posts: 1795 | From: Fall River, Ma | Registered: Feb 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Jason Christopher
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Randy, that certainly is a dilemma. I don't know why it seems that you can't tell people that if everybody raised their rates ... they'd still all be working for the same money per week. Sure you may loose a gig .. but you work half as much and make the same. It's tough to get it through some peoples head that there is a market price and you can charge that market price.

One of the things I recommed is eductating the bar owners. Offer MORE then what the competition is doing. That way they can't compare you to the competion becuase they don't do what you offer.

Trying to get into a gig where a bad KJ has been could be rough. Could you offer the bar owner this offer. "I'll come in at the same rate as your last KJ for 1 month. After that, it's my ;normal rate. If you can honestly look me in the eye and say that I'm not better then the last guy, I'll pack up my equipment and leave. What have you got to loose? "

What do you think?

Randy, I think I know what you need. You need a USP.

What is a USP you ask? It stands for Unique Selling Proposition.
It is in essence this:

What is the ONE THING that makes your potential customers want to hire you as opposed to any of the competetors or doing nothing at all.
THAT is what you need to answer. If you can find out the one thing that seperates you from the pack you can do this. BTW, being 'the best' is not the answer.
Some Famouse USP's:
1) When it absolutely positively has to get there overnight
2) hot fresh pizza delivered to your door in 30 minutes or less guaratneed
3) melts in your mouth, not in your hand.

Jason

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Jason Christopher
Discover How To Increase The Money You Earn As A KJ During Each Show And Have Your Phone Ringing Off The Hook With Prospects Looking To Book YOU! Visit www.makemoneywithkaraoke.com today for FREE mini E-Course

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rjthe1god
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What I need is a way to level the playing field, without alienating the bar/club owners from doing karaoke. I would like nothing more than to bring the wrath of the greedy corporations down on every last one of them, but I know in the process that I would single handily be responsible for killing the business in this area.

See there are two kinds of people out here. Greedy penny pinching owners who get whomever and whatever at the lowest price possible, and the ignorant I don't care what they do as long as they bring me business. Either of whom would throw a person to the wolves if they knew it would prevent anything bad happening to them. Not the kind of people I like doing business with at all. There are a few good owners around, but they have people I know, and there are lines you cross, and lines you don't cross.

In the meantime, much to my dismay I'll keep renting my equipment out or doing as many private parties as possible, at least I'll make more than giving myself away for nothing. Just sucks that I could do that and have some steady weekly gigs too. since that's what got me into the business in the first place.

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Randy Jersky
Owner/Operator
Sound Waves DJ/Karaoke Service

Posts: 1795 | From: Fall River, Ma | Registered: Feb 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Showtimecalls
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Randy pay no attention to him, we've been around a long time and know whats what in the karaoke world of business..We are part of the very small respectable do it the right way type of business people. regardless I may be able to help you out with the extra incentive thats helped a few of us on here. you can email me also...Kshavy2002@yahoo.com
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RC the DJ
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Mister Christopher;

While I applaud your enthusiasm, I feel that your grounding in reality is somewhat short-sighted. As RJ has succintly pointed out, it falls on the bar owners to make these decisions, and the majority of them specifically are all about the bottom line. No matter how much you dress up your presentation to them, they'll simply retort with, "So how much?" They go into negotiations having been approached by several pirate multiriggers who will gladly throw you under a bus by offering their pirated libraries and p*ss-poor systems for WAY under what would be a fair market value.

See? That's the problem. "Fair Market Value" is only good if everyone is playing fair. I'm having a devil of a time getting more that my lousy two days a week, and I have INVENTED promotional programs (The Karaoke Scouts and the Big Money Mystery Song) that would bring in new clientele if properly advertised.

-which brings up another bone of contention...

Advertising. How do you get your bar owner to go along with it, short of the free beer-vendor banners and sloppy copy in-house signs? I'll go far to make things look right, but even *I'll* set limits on how much bang they'll get for their buck.

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one of the last legitimate karaoke hosts in the Pacific Northwest...

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Jason Christopher
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RJ,
the way you 'level the playing field' is by setting your markets buying criteria. Bascially, YOU educate your potential client about the benefits and what to look for when they are looking for a KJ. You make it so that YOU are the only one that can meet ALL of the criteria. I'm not the cheapest in my market. I'm one of the most expensive entertainers...and I work a decent amount. Would I like to be busier? Yes, BUT ONLY IF IT'S ON MY TERMS. RJ ... how many bars are in your area that you are comfortable driving for a show? Have you promoted to them all? I mean ALL? When was the last time? Keep promoting... owners change, clientele change, perceptions to karoake change, the KJ screws up so bars look to change.

Jason

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Jason Christopher
Discover How To Increase The Money You Earn As A KJ During Each Show And Have Your Phone Ringing Off The Hook With Prospects Looking To Book YOU! Visit www.makemoneywithkaraoke.com today for FREE mini E-Course

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Jason Christopher
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RC, what if you eliminated the "how much" question? What if you were only dealing with clients who called YOU instead of calling you AND other KJ's ?

What if you were able to position yourself as the expert KJ in the area ... what if you positioned yourself to HELP your bar owner and NOT sell him on a karaoke show. (BTW, if they're not interested in Karaoke, I highly doubt they'll ever book a Karaoke show--it's POSSIBLE but most bar owners are too dumb to see that karaoke can be good for business even if THEY don't like it...)

What if you were able to educate your bars what a P*ss poor system sounds and looks like so they knew it when they saw it? Could you relate it to them in terms they understood? EXAMPE: Look a crappy beer tap is made from aluminum, it's fragile, breaks and you have to replace it twice a year. A Chrome beer tap does cost twice as much. You may MAY have to replace it in 5 years. Equate karaoke to something they understand and EDUCATE them.

Jason

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Jason Christopher
Discover How To Increase The Money You Earn As A KJ During Each Show And Have Your Phone Ringing Off The Hook With Prospects Looking To Book YOU! Visit www.makemoneywithkaraoke.com today for FREE mini E-Course

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rjthe1god
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My business philosophy has always been this. I have a particular service, and I am extremely good at what I do. The party has a particular need for my service and likes what I have to offer. If the party is going to be halfhearted about the whole idea and won't give it at least a fair shot or have unreasonable expectations then I won't do business with them.

I don't believe there is a lot of selling of the product, I do believe that if I have to twist someone's arm to hire me is just a canceled show waiting to happen.

Also just because you are some so called expert on how you make money doing karaoke doesn't mean that it works for everyone. Some people are reserved, and will cave in to pressure no matter what. On the other hand I am, arrogant, egotistical, prideful, uncaring, and most of all business minded. So taking all of those characteristics I already believe what my time is worth, end of story. It becomes a take it or leave it attitude, because personally I have obligations just like everyone else.

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Randy Jersky
Owner/Operator
Sound Waves DJ/Karaoke Service

Posts: 1795 | From: Fall River, Ma | Registered: Feb 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Timberlea
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The only one trying to sell a product is Jason.
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Mark Speck
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And from reading his posts, someone should sell Jason a Spellcheck!! [Wink]

Best,

Mark

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Star Karaoke
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Jason Christopher I see you are a "JUNIOR" newbie to karaoke. I admire your naivete about business. It was my MAJOR in college. I know in each club what my target market is-and I can easily cover all except(I DO NOT carry adult rated RAP). I have played ALL kinds of ethnicities, been in this biz since 3/1/97.

Like many longtime KJs here, I AM an expert on the karaoke industry. Customers still ask for me constantly, but club owner mentality is get it CHEAP; quality is low on the radar in this economy. Clubs only care if they make profit not HOW MUCH profit unfortunately. With such crappy abundant cheap shows (since none paid for music) like any flooded market there is NO dramatic raising of prices unless you OWN the club.

These types of karaoke KJs have caused our newsprint to look down on karaoke as entertainment-it is a JOKE. The fact is any fool with a pirated illegal hard drive thinks they are a STAR/KJ not understanding all the biz hats needed to RUN a successful show besides not paying the price to BUY their music as we legal KJs did. Many times customers are treated like poo.

I am asked constantly by these KJs to be able to copy MY large libraries. My reply is, "Sure for $350K," buy into my biz/brand and copy away!

I have educated the bars, they are NOT interested in anything but cost in this environment, as any biz savvy KJ knows. I am fortunate in that I will at some point be able to have my own place and all the headaches that come with it. I have been a student on all facets of running a biz besides personal observations over the years. I have collected all the paperwork and info on what I need to open/license/etc.

I would gladly submit you are incorrect until there is a level playing field on earning a business/working fee.

I CAN sit out or pick and choose unlike many KJs. My children are grown on their own, we have other income, everything I have is paid for, buying with 10% of my gross over the months and years since I started in March 1997. So if KJs want to work CHEAP, I say make them BUY their music-then I have NO BEEF. I draw crowds still, but that is not always enough today. No it is not my fault foolish people work for almost nothing, then complain to me they aren't making what I was making all those years! I work smart as do many legal KJs here-as a newbie tell me do you make $350-$400 a four hour show in clubs? I used to average that 5 nights a week, yes well over $1,000 a week. Shows here are lucky to earn $75 a night. I looked out for my clubs, advertised, attracted free TV promos/ads. The local paper recently did a piece on me, front page section in the Sunday paper. Keep the pie in the sky attitude-reality WILL eventually bite! To say the problem is with the legal KJ is to deny reality.


STAR KARAOKE /Debra Lewis (Facebook)

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Spaz Out Ent.
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i understand everything you all have been saying - ive been hosting karaoke for over 6 years but for a bar with an inhoust system. due to bar owners law probs the bar closed so i chgose to go out on my own. im leagle 100% - but im finding it hard to get that first gig - ive been checking every bar in the area and seems like everyone already has there host - my thing is i dont want to step on anyones toes --- what can i do to get this thing off the ground - i know i dont have a bunch of songs (2700+) full computer system. does anyone have any ideas on what i can do? ----- DJ spaz
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rjthe1god
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You have to sell yourself. The problem is most bars knowing you are new are going to beat you down in price, and may never give you the chance to make what you deserve.

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Randy Jersky
Owner/Operator
Sound Waves DJ/Karaoke Service

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toastedmuffin
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Sadly, Bar owners are more far concerned with cheap prices then quality around here. I've been in this business for 13 years, and I STILL am getting the same rates I was from when I started.

The $69 promo is a nice idea, but I've been burned by this type of promotion before. The bar wants a cheap KJ to host a "public" private party, and then the bar is never heard from again.

Thank to pirating, my book thats been built over 13 years, is the norm, not the exception.

I've spent a LOT of money over the years. Upgrading equipment, adding to my songbook, etc. I don't even profess to be a DJ by trade, I am 100% a karaoke host. All of that service, knowledge, skill, etc. doesntt mean a thing when according to the bar; "A bad singer is still bad no matter how much I pay" and thats all the reason they need to pay what they do. Its very sad our profession indeed.

:tm:

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Lonman
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Thing the bars that want cheap do not realize, that a kj with a good system and knows how to use it will cost a bit more, but they will also usually attract singers who can actually sing over the stereotypical 'bad karaoke' singer.

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Lonman Productions

We don't entertain you, you entertain EVERYONE!!!

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SingingFool
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Amen...Lonman.
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Karaoke_Mafia
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Just today I stumbled across this forum and thought I'd give my input into the situation.

I used to DJ/KJ in Cincinnati Ohio about 3 years ago and had been doing it for almost 7 years prior to that. I took out a loan for 75K and got speakers, lights, mixers, and discs and a laptop with external hard drive so I could start to run digitally. About 4 years ago, my house was broken into and everything was stolen. The police was called and not one thing was ever recovered. The only thing I had left was the laptop, mixer, and two microphones I was using to host with the night my place got robbed.

4 years ago I stopped doing karaoke, but recently my wife has been prodding me to restart my karaoke company, but I don't have any disks or anything, just a hard drive that has about 45,000 songs on it.

When I was looking for new shows, I would offer the venues a "half-priced" option. Since most shows typically go from 9-1 I would offer the first two hours free and at the end of those 2 hours cut everything off. The next two hours I would charge my full rate. I charged $150.00 for 4 hours. If the venue owner agreed that business was good I would stay and finish out the show get paid and go home, but if not.. I would pack up at the end of those to hours, shake hands and try another place. I was doing karaoke 6 nights a week using that little business tactic in which the main focus was to make sure that every singer you had was the most important person in the world for those 5 minutes they are singing.

Don't be discouraged when you are faced with cheap venue owners. They are trying to look out for their own interests first, just like any sensible business owner.

My advice is to make sure you are a cut above the rest. Have an outgoing personality, have some decent equipment and know how to listen to your singers and the music so that you can get a nice blend of the two. Learn about speaker placement to keep feedback down and also so your singers can hear themselves as well as the crowd. Smile at your customers and always thank them for turning in a slip.

It's the little common courtesies that can make or break a gig...

Take care friends,

--------------------
The DJ of the Karaoke Mafia

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MADPROAUDIO
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We propose that each kj that feels they cannot get business because of another kj has some loaded computer with tens of thousands of songs loaded on it should start a grass roots movement to investigate (contact local attorney) and file a lawsuit against that kj (ONLY IF) you can prove they are unfairly competing against you with pirated material. You should have rights too and if this is the living you make, then fight for your future! Just as you are tired of these kj's with loaded computers and NO proof of proper purchase, license, etc.. We are also tired of losing sale after sale after sale to other sellers online that are not playing by the rules. Good luck to those that are having this problem. We sincerley mean it as we are suffering from the same problem.
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MADPROAUDIO
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By the way. If the kj is legit and is undercutting you. Then there is no problem. You just have to take the suggestions of others and figure out ways to put out a better overall product/service. Good luck to all.
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